It's mostly related to the details. We try to create everything as real as possible (so signs for the countries, real license plates, landmarks, right fonts etc etc)
At the start TSM copied the standard ETS2 map and changed the names of the cities. They are now improving but they often still lack the real signs, lp's etc (for example Greece was a copy of Italy, even with the tollbooths)...
But ofc everyone is entitled to their own opinion about the maps.
Other Map Discussion (Mainly TSM)
I heard about negative comments about TSM first before getting a chance to decide to try it. But I know I will get annoyed with TSM because of the mentioned shortcomings. With the amount of time I spend driving ETS2 I want a good map with a reallife feel to it. At the moment I have DLC going east, poland rebuilding and the latest Promods.
TSM is a very good map... I have no idea how to mod maps or anything really, so to be able to mod hundreds of and roads in a relative amount of detail is a credit to their team. I do agree with you on the fact TSM did a good job with Denmark, but that is one of the only good parts of the map imo, and Promods has done as well in the country if not better. You will notice some scaling issues in places such as the Greek port, as I pointed out a while back. (It's a shame I don't have any screenshots)
I haven't pulled up two similar locations on the map either, and, no offence, maybe you're not sure about the quality aspect because you're American, and European roads are obviously entirely different, so it is easier for Europeans to judge them, unless of course you actually live in Europe, or visit it regularly, in which case this paragraph means nothing to you.
Ok, so, all I can say is, as a European, Promods is a better option to me because it shows contrast, and detail, more so than TSM, e.g differences between France and Scandinavia, which Promods shows through signage, different scenery on roads etc. Now don't get me wrong, TSM does show differences between countries, but not to the extent of Promods. Especially in Northern Africa, which it seems to portray as only desert for one half and only beach and leaves for the other.
Another thing that put me off TSM is the constant trailer damage,
I will say, the last time I played the map, it was version 3.5, and we are now on what? 4.5.3?, so if anyone has played the new map and it is any different to the aforementioned in any good way (less rear-endings etc), I'd like to hear about it.
Footnote: I started typing before the last two comments came in
I haven't pulled up two similar locations on the map either, and, no offence, maybe you're not sure about the quality aspect because you're American, and European roads are obviously entirely different, so it is easier for Europeans to judge them, unless of course you actually live in Europe, or visit it regularly, in which case this paragraph means nothing to you.
Ok, so, all I can say is, as a European, Promods is a better option to me because it shows contrast, and detail, more so than TSM, e.g differences between France and Scandinavia, which Promods shows through signage, different scenery on roads etc. Now don't get me wrong, TSM does show differences between countries, but not to the extent of Promods. Especially in Northern Africa, which it seems to portray as only desert for one half and only beach and leaves for the other.
Another thing that put me off TSM is the constant trailer damage,
You are right; there is a hill just on the way out of Southampton which I used to slow right down on in an underpowered truck, and got rear-ended several times. However, I don't believe that there are that many steep hills on African carriageways, so the problem is that TSM did'nt think that through.Izargon wrote:I don't necessarily think that these rear ends happen on just tsm either; in fact they might be faults in the game ai itself when dealing with longer heavier trailers, but I havent done enough on the main game lately to be sure of that.
I will say, the last time I played the map, it was version 3.5, and we are now on what? 4.5.3?, so if anyone has played the new map and it is any different to the aforementioned in any good way (less rear-endings etc), I'd like to hear about it.
Footnote: I started typing before the last two comments came in
- MandelSoft
- Lead Developer
- Posts: 3835
- Joined: 08 Aug 2013 10:48
- Location: Delft [NL]
Well, just out of curiousity I downloaded the TSM 4.5.3 map, just to see what the competition is doing. My first impressions were quite bad. The map lacks detail in general. When browsing around in France, all roads looked the same: the same boring empty, desolate landscape without farmlands, something that's in complete contrast with Kutchek's France map. I can get lost on this map because every road looks the same, while on the SCS map and the ProMods map, it's not that hard to distinguish different map sections and roads. It's something we can make in 5 minutes:
Up close it's not impressive either.
Even some mapping oddities like this, which shows that the work can miss some common sense:
Some of the new things they did implement looks kinda cool, but also a bit glitchy:
Some other aspect they didn't put effort in is signage. In more than one instance I've found more than one instance that the wrong country style signage is used and that the text didn't fit on the sign.
And more than once, they selected the wrong fonts. For instance, Germany uses DIN1451, but this clearly looks like Arial Bold:
Now, we do have one point where we can compare the Promods map with the TSM map: South-Denmark. This is where the TSM and the Promods map have four cities in common: Esbjerg, Kolding, Odense and København.
First, the bridges. They have used the wrong bridge types for both the Øresundbron and the Størebeltbron, where they don't even resemble even close their real counterparts.
Størebeltbron:
Øresundbron:
Second, the landscaping. This is equally not impressive to the rest of the map. Here's an example of the E20 near Esbjerg:
And finally the signage. It just makes me cringe that they blatantly used the Hungarian signage for this, which doesn't look even close to Danish signage. Heck, they didn't even bother to select a proper signage font for this, but just Arial!
In brief, a lot can be done on improving the details on TSM. I've only explored a quite small part of the map, but this already shows quite some problems of TSM. I'm not so impressed about the map, because the lack of detail makes this a quick and easy job, whereas we put in weeks and months of work in detailing...
(And yes, I know the Steam screenshot server is currently having problems).
Best,
Maarten
Up close it's not impressive either.
Even some mapping oddities like this, which shows that the work can miss some common sense:
Some of the new things they did implement looks kinda cool, but also a bit glitchy:
Some other aspect they didn't put effort in is signage. In more than one instance I've found more than one instance that the wrong country style signage is used and that the text didn't fit on the sign.
And more than once, they selected the wrong fonts. For instance, Germany uses DIN1451, but this clearly looks like Arial Bold:
Now, we do have one point where we can compare the Promods map with the TSM map: South-Denmark. This is where the TSM and the Promods map have four cities in common: Esbjerg, Kolding, Odense and København.
First, the bridges. They have used the wrong bridge types for both the Øresundbron and the Størebeltbron, where they don't even resemble even close their real counterparts.
Størebeltbron:
Øresundbron:
Second, the landscaping. This is equally not impressive to the rest of the map. Here's an example of the E20 near Esbjerg:
And finally the signage. It just makes me cringe that they blatantly used the Hungarian signage for this, which doesn't look even close to Danish signage. Heck, they didn't even bother to select a proper signage font for this, but just Arial!
In brief, a lot can be done on improving the details on TSM. I've only explored a quite small part of the map, but this already shows quite some problems of TSM. I'm not so impressed about the map, because the lack of detail makes this a quick and easy job, whereas we put in weeks and months of work in detailing...
(And yes, I know the Steam screenshot server is currently having problems).
Best,
Maarten
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Don't ask us for a release date; we don't know either.
Hi Marteen.
I'm not sucking up or anything but this is affair assessment I gave it a brief spin (very brief ) and just couldn't handle it .
After driving on Promods , Romanian , Italian, and Poland map there is no comparison with TSM , I'm sorry but after the last effort and very limited support this was a real turn off I'm afraid won't going back for a while .
Please understand I'm not sledging them but like you say it's merely attention to detail .
Regards
Adrian
I'm not sucking up or anything but this is affair assessment I gave it a brief spin (very brief ) and just couldn't handle it .
After driving on Promods , Romanian , Italian, and Poland map there is no comparison with TSM , I'm sorry but after the last effort and very limited support this was a real turn off I'm afraid won't going back for a while .
Please understand I'm not sledging them but like you say it's merely attention to detail .
Regards
Adrian
As i have been reading about mapmods, TSM is about quantity over quality, Promods is quality over quantity! Poland rebuilding makes a nice additions to promods!
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- Location: Ljungby
I played with TSM for a pretty long time actually but i stopped when i saw the awful truth - they don't give a sh*t about details.
Here's what they need to do:
1: Properly use FLD's prefabs. Currently, they are misusing them. Just take a look at this interchange at Osnabruck, in which is going to be included in the 5.0 version of the map:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiCTD1sH25c
And yes, it doensn't even look close to it's real counterpart.
2: They should use Google Earth! It's insanity to not use such a great program also, they should use street view (almost, atleast) all the time.
3: Upgrade the old formats! I can expect that they are a pain to go trough on older computers
And finally, 4: They should realise that quantity over quality doesn't work. I can understand that mixing them might be hard to do nicely but seriously, if it's done well then it's gonna be well worth to play
Here's what they need to do:
1: Properly use FLD's prefabs. Currently, they are misusing them. Just take a look at this interchange at Osnabruck, in which is going to be included in the 5.0 version of the map:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiCTD1sH25c
And yes, it doensn't even look close to it's real counterpart.
2: They should use Google Earth! It's insanity to not use such a great program also, they should use street view (almost, atleast) all the time.
3: Upgrade the old formats! I can expect that they are a pain to go trough on older computers
And finally, 4: They should realise that quantity over quality doesn't work. I can understand that mixing them might be hard to do nicely but seriously, if it's done well then it's gonna be well worth to play
- MandelSoft
- Lead Developer
- Posts: 3835
- Joined: 08 Aug 2013 10:48
- Location: Delft [NL]
A Promods look at the TSM Map, part deux...
Yesterday, Paul (DaSquirrelNuts on Twitch and YouTube) did stream driving around the TSM Map. Here and there, I recognised a few scenes. So, I was bored again today and tired of mapping, and I went around the TSM Map again (for Schadenfreude, to be honest). At some locations, I've seen some striking similarities.
For instance, here's the airport near Tripoli, Libya. Does this look familair?
Well, it should, because this is a slightly modified copy of Schiphol Airport near Amsterdam, the Netherlands
And this is not the only example. Take a look at the following ones.
Tripolis is just Amsterdam, but with less details.
Marseille you say? I say Rotterdam:
Oh c'mon! You're not even trying at Caïro!
The thing is that they don't only copy entire cities. True, we did copy some of SCS cities in our map. But TSM goes even beyond that: they copy entire sceneries! For instance, take this part of Greece...
... which is actually a direct copy of this part of the Netherlands.
No wonder why the TSM Team can expand that fast! It's just copy-paste all over the place! However, if they do not use copy paste, well, you get this kind of bland scenery...
EEEEEWWWWWW!!!
Well, that's it for today
Best,
MandelSoft
Yesterday, Paul (DaSquirrelNuts on Twitch and YouTube) did stream driving around the TSM Map. Here and there, I recognised a few scenes. So, I was bored again today and tired of mapping, and I went around the TSM Map again (for Schadenfreude, to be honest). At some locations, I've seen some striking similarities.
For instance, here's the airport near Tripoli, Libya. Does this look familair?
Well, it should, because this is a slightly modified copy of Schiphol Airport near Amsterdam, the Netherlands
And this is not the only example. Take a look at the following ones.
Tripolis is just Amsterdam, but with less details.
Marseille you say? I say Rotterdam:
Oh c'mon! You're not even trying at Caïro!
The thing is that they don't only copy entire cities. True, we did copy some of SCS cities in our map. But TSM goes even beyond that: they copy entire sceneries! For instance, take this part of Greece...
... which is actually a direct copy of this part of the Netherlands.
No wonder why the TSM Team can expand that fast! It's just copy-paste all over the place! However, if they do not use copy paste, well, you get this kind of bland scenery...
EEEEEWWWWWW!!!
Well, that's it for today
Best,
MandelSoft
Your daily dose of wisdom!
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Don't ask us for a release date; we don't know either.
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Don't ask us for a release date; we don't know either.
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Oh my god - it just makes me wanna puke when i see this MandelSoft
Seriously, TSM is nothing else than a big mess now. Copying and dull scenery is just only one of the few things that currently makes TSM the worst map mod ever. Urgh... *facepalm*
Seriously, TSM is nothing else than a big mess now. Copying and dull scenery is just only one of the few things that currently makes TSM the worst map mod ever. Urgh... *facepalm*
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