I don't know if it's just me, but Promods Spain > SCS Iberia

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tantalus
Posts: 130
Joined: 04 Mar 2019 01:14

22 Apr 2021 03:35

jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
What exactly would they move onto another core? Low-hanging fruit like sound and saving have already been broken out AFAIK.
Many games still don't have great multicore utilisation. Also, ETS2 *is* a game from 2013 built on top of another from 2011.
Erm.. more cores, more performance, more space to do a million more things, more performance on older computers, ETC ETC.
And what? you must be really young dude. 100% games today have multi-core support and of course they use them. In some cases even all of them.
I mean, you are talking about completely ESSENTIAL in gaming today. If you cant understand this, as i said, you must be very young (or maybe the opposite around?).
jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
DX11 isn't as simple as flicking a switch. The new lighting and AO have been added because of the move to DX11, yet you bemoan the same later on.
Yes, it is. 100% of games today have FULL support of directx (and most of them today already give you the option of DX12).
Allowing you to use more accurate features, with less performance cost, and better quality (like better AO, better AA, etc).
Again, you dont understand. AO was added as an attrezo because its awful as sin. The game itself dont have a proper shadow casting system to allow proper AO to start with.
And if you played more videogames, you would realize how bad are shadows in this game. Terrible.
But everybody bought it. As always happens when SCS releases a new "thing".
jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
It has SMAA already. Not to mention that TAA and TXAA aren't Anti-Aliasing in the traditional sense, it's intended to blur motion, the visual softening is a side effect (that usually looks like shit). Not to mention that they're vendor-locked.
Erm.. SMAA is exactly like TAA but a million times worst. Both are postprocess shaders.
SMAA was another dumb addition by SCS to make people believe they actually had intentions to improve graphic quality and specially antialiasing.
SMAA is exactly like MLAA, the one we had before it. Its even worst because its another postprocess antialiasing, not a decent one.
But again, people bought it. Because SCS knows many people dont even know what aliasing is. Apparently.
And yes TAA blurres the image a bit, but if you are telling me that you prefer to play with all that shimmering on the landscapes destroying your eyes,
instead of a little blur.. i dont know. Im concerned lol. You cant even see any detail on the landscapes because of this problem, so yeah.
Also you can always sharpen the image by other means, like MOST smart players do (the ones using nvidia inspector)
using something like the sharpening filter from nvidia control panel. Most games today if not all have the option to use TAA,
because shimmering is a common problem in today's games. In ETS2 is a real problem, but people seem to think its ok.. :shock:
jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
Not like they just went through and entirely rebuilt the lighting, shading and material systems almost from the ground up. Or reworked the entire physics system two years ago to allow doubles to work properly. Or spent nearly 8 years providing free updates to one game. Noooooo, not at all.
Again. Why to waste resources on it when you have more urgent and important matters to atend to. If you cant have proper shadows, or proper antialiasing, or other things, make that a priority instead
of working on a new lighting system over an obsolete engine and obsolete features. Reworked physics system entirely? again, you guys are pretty naive.
jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
The sounds are done by one guy. They could be improved, but because there's only one person working on it it's a slow process.

Also, keeping income coming in is pretty important too. Map expansions are in high demand. Map designers don't do the programming or material work.

And again the new lighting probably isn't finished.
Its not about the speed. Truck sounds are awful no matter what version of ETS2 is released. This have been happening since i started playing on 1.31-1.32
Many people have been complaining about it over the years, but it seems that we need, again, to use mods to achieve good truck sounds.

I dont want to smash the new lightning system, it has pros and cons, my "anger" is more directed to the DLC than anything else, because at this point i dont think
im ever going to see this game looking good. So, we need to rely on nvidia inspector to make the game playable.

The DLC could be called infinite roads empire or something like that. Anything but "Iberia". Sadly.
It is unfortunate that we need to play with it using promods, but i hope that in a future we can see a version that overwrites SCS Iberia completely.

Shiva
Posts: 3392
Joined: 21 May 2015 01:09

22 Apr 2021 09:03

Question.
Have you ever compared the other DLC's to Real Life?
Photos, google maps, streetviews etc?
Youtube video of a Semi Truck in Monaco 2011. Route driven. Possible modern ETS2 routes 1 and 2 and their combinations.
ProMods v2.33 and RusMap v1.8.1 load order for ETS2 1.34

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realdeal350
Developer
Posts: 1746
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 02:14

22 Apr 2021 14:08

There are plenty of areas in DLC Iberia that look amazing and plenty of areas that unfortunately look far from real life. Nevertheless, we'll be using the DLC's awesome new assets to improve our Spain and then improve the rest of the DLC in the future. ;)
Spain developer
Canada developer
Regional Co-ordinator for the Roman region

Languages: English, italiano

Shiva
Posts: 3392
Joined: 21 May 2015 01:09

22 Apr 2021 15:58

A Z-40 complete? Maybe?
I haven't checked how it looks any closer tho. Yet.

La Jonquera, if not too much happening in France, then SCS's LJ would be a very nice base for a rebuild.
Yeah, some smaller adjustments needed close to the now driveable areas tho.

Madrid, SCS's combo of M-40 and M-45, I do think is OK.
M-40/A-1, there SCS made it more user friendly with a Cloverleaf interchange, altho the original might have worked.
They done that for AP-7 / C-33 in Barcelona too.
ProMods going more hardcore?

Gibraltar might be possible. Altho myself, I would prefer it with the Runway Tunnel, whenever it is finished IRL. This summer? This year? 2030's?!

Teruel, adding downtown? or instead of SCS Exit 115, having 117 ingame instead?
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.3744 ... m1!1b1!3e0 As an example.

Lot of options for you. + Will be interesting to see what happend and where, in the future.
Youtube video of a Semi Truck in Monaco 2011. Route driven. Possible modern ETS2 routes 1 and 2 and their combinations.
ProMods v2.33 and RusMap v1.8.1 load order for ETS2 1.34

Truckingfun9810
Posts: 117
Joined: 10 Jul 2020 05:45
Donation rank:

22 Apr 2021 17:21

realdeal350 wrote:
22 Apr 2021 14:08
There are plenty of areas in DLC Iberia that look amazing and plenty of areas that unfortunately look far from real life. Nevertheless, we'll be using the DLC's awesome new assets to improve our Spain and then improve the rest of the DLC in the future. ;)
I would be glad to see the return of small roads of Pyrenees and cities like Huesca, Jaca and La honquera. And also probably a unlikely wish: an improvement of Madrid by adding its city center, similar to Promods treatment to London. :lol: :lol:

Shiva
Posts: 3392
Joined: 21 May 2015 01:09

22 Apr 2021 18:48

Madrid city center, well, a bus station, might maybe someday be made by SCS?
Some basics are ingame.
Youtube video of a Semi Truck in Monaco 2011. Route driven. Possible modern ETS2 routes 1 and 2 and their combinations.
ProMods v2.33 and RusMap v1.8.1 load order for ETS2 1.34

User avatar
realdeal350
Developer
Posts: 1746
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 02:14

23 Apr 2021 05:04

The main priority right now is to merge in as much of our current work as we think necessary, and then use the new DLC assets to improve our areas. This is quite a complex task since not all the roads line up well. After the merge is completed, which could take a while, we'll consider improving other parts of the DLC. :)

I agree that Madrid is not very well represented in-game other than the A-6/M-40 junction area. It's a shame considering that it's the capital and largest city of Spain.
Spain developer
Canada developer
Regional Co-ordinator for the Roman region

Languages: English, italiano

Shiva
Posts: 3392
Joined: 21 May 2015 01:09

23 Apr 2021 07:55

M-45 Exit 7 looks ok, for me. Altho, I do not have a clue what the industrial area south of it is.
M-45/A-4, especially the road from there to the depot northeast of it, for me looks excellent.
Airport area looks nice too.

So prio woild be to re add:
La Jonquera, Manresa, Huesca, Soria ?
Youtube video of a Semi Truck in Monaco 2011. Route driven. Possible modern ETS2 routes 1 and 2 and their combinations.
ProMods v2.33 and RusMap v1.8.1 load order for ETS2 1.34

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MandelSoft
Lead Developer
Posts: 3835
Joined: 08 Aug 2013 10:48
Location: Delft [NL]

23 Apr 2021 17:04

tantalus wrote:
22 Apr 2021 03:35
jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
What exactly would they move onto another core? Low-hanging fruit like sound and saving have already been broken out AFAIK.
Many games still don't have great multicore utilisation. Also, ETS2 *is* a game from 2013 built on top of another from 2011.
(...)
100% games today have multi-core support and of course they use them. In some cases even all of them .(...)
jdenm8 wrote:
20 Apr 2021 09:51
DX11 isn't as simple as flicking a switch. The new lighting and AO have been added because of the move to DX11, yet you bemoan the same later on.
Yes, it is. 100% of games today have FULL support of directx (and most of them today already give you the option of DX12).
(...)
But everybody bought it. As always happens when SCS releases a new "thing".
Seriously, do you have any experience in programming whatsoever? As jdenm8 is saying, this is not a matter of flicking a switch, or just add some code libraries and you're done. No, this would mean you have to retrofit your code, or in some cases build your code from scratch again to do these modifications, because these are deep modifications within the program, and involve the foundation of the entire code. All of this, while the game is still live, and SCS needs to keep a stable version up just to make sure that players can keep on playing the game.

Let me put this into an analogy:
You are living in a brick house. But you have some problems with it, and the house shows its age. So you're asking me to take an existing brick house, and ask if I can replace each and every single brick in them with the latest and greatest on the market, and also all the isolation material, because you want to get them energy bills down, and oh, replace the concrete foundation while I'm at it. Oh, and while I'm doing that, you demand that you continue living in it with as little annoyance as possible and everything needs to remain functional. So while I'm starting to replace the isolation, and try to plaster the wall to finish it in an aesthetically pleasing, you complain about me plastering the walls, because it's "not essential" to you, and I need to focus on replacing the concrete foundation. When I try to tell you how hard it is to do so, you keep on telling me what the pro's are of this new concrete foundation. I'm very well aware of these pro's, but you just don't have any idea how hard it is. Or even worse, realise that in order to replace the foundation, I have to break down the entire house first in order to replace the concrete foundation, and then build the house up again. But you demanded to continue living in it. You're not even paying me extra for the additional work I have to do. You even have the audacity to say I'm not working quick enough. All the while, you fail to see the hard work I've actually done, and you even didn't consider how much effort that work took. To me, you sound really ungrateful, and only point out the things that go wrong, or aren't to your liking, while ignoring all the things that did go right.

I could say a similar thing about how you criticised the Iberia map DLC:
tantalus wrote:
22 Apr 2021 03:35
I dont want to smash the new lightning system, it has pros and cons, my "anger" is more directed to the DLC than anything else, because at this point i dont think
im ever going to see this game looking good. So, we need to rely on nvidia inspector to make the game playable.

The DLC could be called infinite roads empire or something like that. Anything but "Iberia". Sadly.
It is unfortunate that we need to play with it using promods, but i hope that in a future we can see a version that overwrites SCS Iberia completely.
Sure, there are some areas that were done better in ProMods, and I'm not even trying to deny that, and there are some specific areas I'm not really happy with either. But then again, there are also areas where the ProMods version was the inferior version (mainly around Bilbao and Barcelona) and in my experience as a player while doing the events, the areas all around the coasts, as well as most of the cities, are really well done, and I really enjoyed driving there. Calling this the worst DLC ever is an enormous hyperbole. It feels like you have a strong case of Home Bias here, and in my opinion, the France is overall more dull (especially the interchange and city design), and don't get me started about Going East....

Overall, you sound very ungrateful, even cynical, only wanting to see the worst in what SCS is doing, all the while praising our work into the heavens. Now, I don't like blind praises as much as I don't like blind hatred. It's not contributing to the discussion, and quite unhelpful even. If you want to bash SCS, please go to somewhere else. All this moaning is getting old really quick...
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Vøytek
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Posts: 10276
Joined: 05 Jan 2014 19:38
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23 Apr 2021 18:16

tantalus wrote:
22 Apr 2021 03:35
more performance on older computers
I can't be bothered reading further, but I laughed pretty hard on this one.
You say there should be multi-core support. How is it going to benefit players with old hardware, who have single-core CPUs?
Also, even cheap multi-core CPUs are definitely enough for this game. I have another PC at home, which is a budget + spare parts build, with a Pentium G3420. Even that old and cheap CPU is enough and performance won't be better with multi-core engine. At some point you have to upgrade your whole gaming platform, because of incompatible Mobo socket. Poor players with cheap laptops have an integrated video card, low RAM amount (and speed) and a slow HDD. And it's actually good for them that they can still enjoy this game in 2021, thanks to SCS, which is trying to still let them play while bringing updates to the visuals...
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